24 July 2014

Integrity, or the lack there of...Updated

EDIT AND WARNING;

The comments to this post, some of them, contain rather rough language and age inappropriate content. I will not however delete them, I will not be accused of editing people or their statements. You have been properly warned.


What a sad bit of business and an open advertisement of dishonesty and lack of integrity, not to mention a lack of reading comprehension.

The old saying that readers are leaders is absolutely true. When folks take another persons word for something they are placing trust in that other person and sometimes that trust is not warranted, it would behoove people in general to 'find out for themselves' to not accept completely what they are sometimes told, trust, but verify applies.

So for those who give a damn about integrity start here; Bushcraft USA Trademarks the word Bushcraft.

For those who don't know it would be hard to lay it out because it goes back a couple years. At its root it comes to egos and measuring sticks and conclusions not accepted because they're founded on opinion and incorrect assumptions based on flawed process and inapplicable 'scientific' processes. Add to that some disgruntled people who's products were not heavily sought after within the vendor section at BCUSA feeling like there was a conspiracy to keep their sales volume down, which is utter bullshit.

Suffice it to say a four year old having a tantrum because he was scolded or denied something is the equivalent.

Read the entirety of the link I posted and actually read it. Do your own research form your own conclusions but realize the truth is there, sometimes it takes some diligence to get to it.

At the end of the day people do some stupid things, they do some low down dirty things, more often than not this comes from their own lack of integrity, their inability to accept criticism, or the pointing out of their lack of knowledge or experience or both. What is shameful is that this mess happens, that something as enjoyable and clean as bushcraft or woodsmanship has this type of behavior in it.

So make up your own minds, don't take any one's word for it, research it yourself if it matters to you.

My affiliation with BCUSA is as a member and nothing more, I've seen incredible acts of generosity, and I've seen accountability. Fakes don't last, liars last half that, words without actions are empty and trying to sell yourself as an expert in something without the actual experience results in busted egos.

Incidentally that also exists somewhere else, it's called LIFE. The problems come when people who espouse themselves to be something they are not; and while the life expectancy of such a persons integrity and respectability can be prolonged in the digital cyberspace of un-verifiability they're still losers in the real world and they'll have a habit of being losers with a string of failures at all manner of levels in their past.

Unless you are versed in Trademark Law you should get educated before making a decision.

Try this first...

Overview of Trademark Law from Harvard Law.

Edit;

Just in case there was some confusion look closely at the images below from 2012.

What do you see? The TM symbol of course. It's been there for years without so much as a hiccup from the Bushcraft community. It's BEEN there and nothing came of it for years.

What has transpired? BCUSA founders established the TM to protect themselves from what they are now being accused of doing.  As a wise fellow said;

Hate to see so many people getting sand in their pants before they stop to think, and then consider that this was done two years ago ! Only reason it came up now is someone started trying to to the EXACT same thing, and found out they could not, so they started an online smear campaign. 
Where was the uproar two years ago? When these knives were made? When the TM appeared on the header at BCUSA?

It is as simple as this;

Someone wanted to trademark bushcraft for their own enterprise, found out it isn't available and pitched a hissy fit. What you are seeing is the result of crying because they didn't get it first.

I would call that good strategy on our part. -Guy

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-D0n_yfF4r9Q/TtpoOlZPTVI/AAAAAAAAEL4/D4VNTEfhj48/s720/014.jpg






41 comments:

  1. Excellent post - I for one was surprised to read this and having read one side of the argument was quite shocked but having now read the other side of the argument and taking your wise words about research on board can see its old news only coming to light as some else tried the same thing. Storm in a tea cup springs to mind .......... thanks for the enlightenment and common sense

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  2. looks like bushcraftUSA is trademarked in your images, its not bushcraft(small tm) USA, its bushcraftUSA(tm), i dont think, legally, a trademark on bushcraft would actually be enforceable, but one on bushcraftUSA very well might be.

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  3. It's probably worth mentioning that this is NOT new news, in fact old news. The true reasoning behind it, however, is another story entirely. Guy Wood made the unfortunate mistake of making his intentions known at a Georgia meet last year. He was saying that he did it so he could shut that other forum down. Then proceeded to make fun of them for most of the night, calling them "Bed&Breakfast". Still don't think there is no harm in this?

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  4. It seems like the thread you provided has been deleted for some reason. From what people remember prior to its deletion, Guy Wood explained that now people who want to operate forums, blogs, or online businesses that include the word bushcraft in their name have to get permission and pay him.

    As it happens, I am an attorney, and I am familiar with trademark law. That being said, none of my opinions about this outrageous act are based on law, but rather on common decency.

    No one, including me would have any issue with "Bushcraft USA" being trademarked, or "Buschraft Outfitters" or "Bush Class", or any other distinctive phrase or term. The problem is that they trademarked the word "bushcraft" itself. The trademark you show on your knife is for "Bushcraft USA', a trademark they do not actually have, not the word "bushcraft" itself. If anything, it is a tactic designed to mislead people and cover up what was done for over two years.

    Now, whether or not there is another dispicable person who tried to trademark the word bushcraft recently, I don't know. If they did they would equally lack integrity as the people who did it two years ago.

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    1. It wasn't deleted, it was moved to where only members could see it.

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    2. Ah, it was moved to the section where only people who agree with you can see it. Nice! Clearly we are after the "truth" here.

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  5. What I don't get is how a person who knows that the term "bushcraft" has been used by others in commerce for decades (Mors Kochanski, for example, as well as other sites that predate the one created by Mr. Wood) could sign an application to the US Patent and Trademark Office under oath swearing that he knew of no other person or persons who had used that phrase in similar commerce predating his application and/or usage, and then turn around and claim that others lack integrity for their continued use of a term common in the field and practice of (insert now trademarked term). That blows my mind.

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  6. It was my meet back in Oct of last year in South Ga that Guy stated that he owned the word bushcraft and that everyone that uses that term would have to stop using the term for business purposes. Guy was very specific and vocal about the forum Blades and Bushcraft, that they would have to change their name or close their site down. He was very angry and spoke badly of these folks.

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    1. Thank you Chuck for stepping up, especially during this time where legal threats are being tossed around as freely as handshakes. You have a strong backbone that is rare to see these days.

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    2. Thanks for stepping up Chuck, I wasn't sure if there was any truth to that until you just said that!

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    3. Chuck, assuming here you weren't the only one that heard this from the owner of BCUSA? There were other witnesses?

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  7. So basically the feud between the banned members and the admins has spilled over onto the rest of us. Regardless, the trademarking of the word bushcraft is beyond arrogant. I foresee there being a bunch of challenges being made
    Thanks for the info there Chuck

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  8. There has been a lot said about this issue in the last two days. A lot of it has been a smoke and mirrors routine worthy of Johnie Cochran. Now, I am very familiar with the law, not just because I read it online, but because I spent years in law school, years of working as an attorney, and have been admitted to practice both on the state and federal level. I can sit here and make legal arguments all day long, and point to you why all of the "defenses" being presented do not hold any weight. I can explain to you why I don't believe Bushcraft USA has a valid trademark. I can tell you how to file a cancellation of trademark request. However, I will not, nor should anyone take what I say as legal advise on the issue.

    Instead, I will ask everyone who is currently going through fine print and Google inspired legal maneuvering, the following:

    Is this the type of America you want to live in? Is this the type of America you want your children to live in? An America where it is considered a good thing that you were first to commit a horrible act. An America where words like "bushcraft", "woodsmanship", "knife", etc can be owned by corporations. An America where it is considered just good business to then try to shut down small forums, blogs, and independent producers who are struggling to make ends meet by selling their products online. An America where all of the above is considered to constitute integrity.

    I ask you this not from a legal stand point, but from a moral and from a common sense perspective.

    I have no delusions of Bushcraft USA LLC going away. They are a large corporation, and if history has thought us anything it's that large corporations don't go away. That doesn't mean we have to pretend that what has been done is not atrocious. At the end of the day, after all of the dust settles, the beginning, middle, and end of the story is that a corporate entity now owns the trademark to the word bushcraft. The WORD bushcraft! We can spin it however we like, but those facts will not change.

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    1. Wow Anon, You Hypocrisy knows no bounds does it. I suggest rechecking yourself before telling someone they need Jesus, and then ending with God Bless. Maybe some time spent on your knees in supplication to God might change your Holier than thou attitude, the same attitude that has been damaging Christianity and driving people away. Go ask yourself What Would Jesus Do before you damage MY FAITH more.

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    2. I am sure no one finds any of it sick, must just be me. Oh well it's there and people can make up their own mind.

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    3. Congratulations! You are officially a Douche. Please only comment further if you wish to discuss BushcraftUSA trademarking the term Bushcraft. Commenting on the personal life of anyone here only discredits you further.

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    4. We will leave running this blog to Grouch. Seems he felt this info worth leaving up, since he left it up and only provided a disclaimer. His call though.

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  9. I've met the owner of the bushcraftbullies™ at the first Woodsmoke and he cried in a kilt that his name wasn't getting dropped enough.

    It doesn't surprise me that this happened. Some asshole was gonna do it sooner or later. We all just know which one it is now.

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    1. You are a lying sack of crap, Chad. You were banned at least twice from BCUSA and have no credibility.

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    2. Everyone knows who you are, so are you not denying the fact that you basically flat out said you were going to shut them down at that GA meet?

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    3. Any of you other big strapping men from BCUSA wanna get involved? Why not post under your real name? Watch what happens to Guy.

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  10. Lots of GOOD folks were banned from bcusa... that doesn't mean they are liars, I've always enjoyed A.G ramblings and posts, but it would appear as tho the story as portrayed in this blog post is not really telling the whole story, whether this is being done on purpose to mislead or not I don't know, but sooner or later we will get the pieces filled in....

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    1. If not banned; then run off, attacked by the Missouri mob, PMs altered, threatened by Sgt. Mac and the list goes on...

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    2. There are many pieces as far as who exactly BCUSA was planning on going after or whether they were planning on going after anyone at all. I think that was in part answered by Buy last night when he pointed out the forum he had actually gone after, and by Chuck here who pointed out another intended target.

      All that being said however, there is no questions that Bushcraft USA LLC trademarked the actual word "bushcraft". If that is not upsetting to people, then there is no problem at all, and nothing to discuss. If one sees it as an issue, then it remains an issue regardless of who says it or how we spin it.

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  11. Time Discovers Truth.

    Of course I've been banned twice! I'm a free thinker that didn't drink the kool aid woody!

    I'll play your villain though. Let's say your right and every 'banned' member that you and your bushcraftnazis™ are hunting down with lawyers and bully tactics really deserve it. What's next?

    -chad

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    1. The whole premise of this witch hunt is the problem, Chad. BCUSA has never contacted an attorney, sent a letter, demanding a fee, etc. All of that information put forth is a lie. I am not sure what else can be said. You have all be duped by Ross.

      I received a call this morning that now my vendors are being brought into this, with lies sent to them as well. We were also accused of gay-bashing Ross, which we certainly didn't do. I have not posted anything anonymously on any of this and never will.

      As for those that are threatening, think about the premise you are threatening under. While we have had words with B&B and yes, I was upset at the time. That was almost a year ago and nothing has been done. No attorney has been contacted or anything else, at this time.

      As for Woodsmoke, we collected the money and sent it to them through our store. We advertised it on BCUSA for free. We also got stuck with a tax bill for that money collected. Do you think a little acknowledgement would have been in order if you had done that?

      Ross, you are good at manipulation, I'll give you that. But, you lied about it all.

      I have nothing else to say on the matter.

      -Guy

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  12. This is blowing up all over the cyber-forest ( trademark pending ) Looks like they have mislead people to believe ( if anyone was even paying attention ) that their trademark was originally only for the term BushcraftUSA(tm) which nobody would have obviously had a problem with, but the real goal it appears was to trademark the word "Bushcraft" which would have a far bigger potential windfall for them....judging from the online backlash, the Bushcraft community is none too pleased.

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  13. Yes, many others heard the conversation. I have their names and contacts. Not that it matters. I'm not here to start a fight, I do not have a dog in the hunt. It was asked about the Ga meet, I answered. What they do at BCUSA is up to them. Some good people on there, some good information, and some bad. Just like life we take the good with the bad.

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  14. Pretty much validates who are the ones really lacking integrity and lives via smoking mirrors. Its a wonder how some can actually look at themselves in the mirror or sleep at night. but then again, evil usually doesnt have a conscience.

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  15. Given the turn of events in this blog alone, perhaps AG should edit his original post to better reflect what is going on here? It is a very strong opinion for someone to have given these new facts brought to light. Maybe those other guys aren't the ones lacking the integrity around here.

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  16. What turn of events? The word of people who have been banned from BCUSA? That got banned for a reason, most likely a lack of integrity. Why would anyone take the word of WT at face value, when he was been spouting venom since he got banned? I have witnessed the humbleness and integrity of the leaders of BCUSA over and over. Why waste your time and emotions on this silly two year old issue. And the only way the parties found out was because they were trying to do the same exact thing.

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    1. Have you read any of this? We found out last October about all of this. We did not try to trademark the word, nor would we ever. We made free public use of our name AND logo available to all our forum members for free. This goes against everything we believe in, and the whole reason we started our forum: To have a place to speak freely. It just so happens that we were tipped off (by a BIG name over there that I happen to still be friends with) what they were planning, and PW decided to let OUR members know that we were facing this ridiculous problem. The internet took over from there. And from the looks of it, there aren't very many people too happy about it. Besides, this whole thing originated OVER THERE, not on our forum. If I have been correctly informed, BushcraftMike started this over there. Maybe someone should ask him how he found out?

      As for Wood Trekker and his personal life, he isn't "spewing venom". He is doing the same thing he has done since I met him. He is speaking his mind. And he doesn't just do it when it comes to bushcraft™, but all things. That's why people have a hard time liking him, because he has the courage to say what is on his mind, despite what the popular kids think.

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  17. I have not been banned from BCUSA. I have only answered a question about the meet on South Ga. I was told this morning that there is video of said conversation, this is incorrect, no recording of this conversation last year. I heard it as well as many others that were present, 7, to my memory.

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  18. You can question the character of someone banned from bcusa all you want, on MOST outdoor Forums, the people getting banned generally are trouble makers... but at bcusa, people get banned for ANY and ALL reasons all of the time. If you go against anything the Admins/Owners and their merry band of minions say you get banned, thats fact. Look up "banned from bcusa" it's almost laughable....when it really comes down to it, anybody who got banned is glad they are gone and got away from that Forum, and lets not forget...there are hundreds more who didn't like what they saw happening at bcusa and left of their own accord.

    Now, lets get back to the issue instead of calling into question the integrity or honesty of banned members....it has little bearing on what bcusa did with respects to trademarking the word "bushcraft"

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  19. For what it's worth, and because I respect AG a good bit, any cyber attacks on a person because of their sexual preference can quite easily be pursued as a hate crime. AG doesn't need that on his blog site and it's totally uncalled for, inappropriate, and simply wrong.

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  21. Hiya Grouch! Nice blog. I like camping too.

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  22. Trademarks are identifiers of business items or services; business names, or exchange names, distinguish a business for non-advertising purposes; and copyrights secure individual, unique works of expression. trademark search.

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  23. Good selection of Outdoor camping,Hiking,Trekking products at https://woodburysupplies.com/

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